Lagondaforum

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi Laurence,
I was imagining the battery was held down and the cover was not included in that (so the fixing is not visible) - cover screwed on after.
The battery sits in a tray that has a lip of about 3/4 inch so can't see the battery could move. The tray is bolted down. We'll probably never know. . . .

David

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi David,
We do now! At last got round to going through the Holthausen Lagonda book. Pages 180 &181 have half-page clear period photos of a bonnet-less LG45. No batteries ... good ... because you can clearly see pairs of long studs, excactly in alignment with how the batteries are placed in your photo. As each side of the car is shown, the studs are visible in both compartments.
So ... your batteries would have been held down by countersunk headed screws, internally threaded, through the battery covers, engaging with those studs.
Needless to say, no such luck for V12 or LG6. Indeed, Holthausen replaced his bulkheads entirely, eliminating any untidy features, so no original battery stay lugs, indeed his batteries appear to be entirely unrestrained. The only good news is that I can see (perhaps unsurprisingly), he sourced period style batteries from Bosch, which gives me an avenue to investigate.
Perhaps I'll contact Arnold to see if he has any V12 battery compartment photos. If you don't have the Holthausen book or access, I can photo the pages; let me know.
Laurence

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi Laurence,
I was wishing I had the Holthausen book, but I don't and you can't get one for a reasonable price. copies of the photos would be appreciated.
David

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi David,
When the Holthausen book was originally published, it appeared extremely expensive at some £300, especially given that I imagined a rehash of Davey's history with some photos of his own cars. I finally got to see a copy of the book around 2010, and realised it was much better than that. I ended up paying £800 for one a couple of years ago ... that price only justified by the fact that it would only get more expensive! Even so, my other interest is antique books ... and I've never paid anything like that, even for multi-volume sets! Mind you, I was more than surprised to find my name in the book ... a photo acknowledgement; surprised as I hadn't been contacted, and had I been, I would have preferred the originator of the photo, John Capon, who worked at Lagonda and let me copy his photos, to be named. Ho hum.
Let me have your email address (perhaps by PM) and I'll take the photos and send to you.
Laurence

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi Laurence,

Yes really expensive now.
Email address sent via PM.

David

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi David, I have experimented with batteries for my LG45 and found that the quality ‘out there’ seems to be variable. However, in 2015 I fitted a pair of 404/19 102Ah Classic 6V Best batteries and they have been excellent. Still providing plenty of cold cranking amps although this winter I needed an extra battery pack to start it when the temperature was just above freezing and it had been sitting for 2 months. That was probably asking a bit much though as I still had thick summer oil in the sump.

Batteries available here https://www.batterycharged.co.uk/shield-404-6v-classic-car-ba-1050033.html

Not cheap so check the dimensions fit your setup.

I hope that helps.

David

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Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi David,

That's the battery I have been looking at and thinking of getting.
Good to have you confirm that it would be a good choice.

Thanks
David

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hmm, the battery I used in my LG6 was actually the one fitted to my Riley RMB in 2015, a Shield 291 (thus a single 12 volt battery), and that had been replaced under guarantee due to a faulty cell even before I collected the car from the body restorer. I last drove my Riley in 1975, and the car rewarded me by running 2400 miles in 7 weeks before running a big end. The battery then saw temporary service on my John Deere mower (which may not have been too kind to it, to be fair, no smooth lawns gere!), before being used in my LG6. The LG6 broke down in 2019, and I've regularly charged the battery since, hoping to use it for the V12, initially. Not to be. A cell has failed. Not too impressed, just 6 years service from a rather expensive battery, I'm used to seeing 10 years plus. So I'm not too sure I'll go the Shield route again, but to be fair, it had a lot of jolting and vibration on the John Deere, and lack of use is not good news for batteries. Mind you, my restorer averred when I originally suggested Lincon for the battery, that Shield make the batteries for Lincon. I'm not sure that is correct, Shield state that they are the only manufacturers of such batteries in the UK, whilst Lincon state they have been batterymen since 1908 and specifically state that their batteries are manufactured on-site. Someone is telling porkies! The classic battery list for both appears remarkably similar ...
So the reality is perhaps that, whatever is said, there is in reality only one classic battery manufacturer, in the UK anyway. Holthausen's book demonstrates that Bosch supply classic batteries, so that is an option, perhaps!
Laurence

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi David,
I haven't forgotten, still getting round to taking photos.
Meanwhile, a little more research. Firstly, your Z4166 number will almost certainly be the Lagonda factory part number. Most of their part numbers for my V12 are Pxxxx, but a smattering are Zxxx, eg the wheels are Z4101/2.
Have at last come across a 1939 Lucas catalogue online. This frustratingly details many cars, but not Lagonda, for most items. Perhaps there's a separate section at the end I haven't got to yet! Nevertheless, struck gold with "Batteries". This states that 1935 (and on, going by their style) 4 1/2 litre : 2-6TXR13. For 1938 LG6 and V12, 2-SLTR15E ... thus it differs slightly from the 2 units SLTSR15E detailed in the handbook. Needless to say, it can't even be that "simple". My works record states (Lagonda part number P8017) 6LTSR15!
The 6TXR13 is also noted as fitted to 1931: all models, 1932: Supercharged, 1933: 2 and 3-Litre. The only other vehicle using a 6TXR13 is the Hispano Suiza 30hp; interestingly, the 37.2hp has a 12TXR13. Raises an interesting point as to the meaning of these references. 6 and 12 are obvious, but some, like those for my V12 have neither stated. I'd take a guess that the other number featured is the number of plates. The letters? Conjecture S = Short, L = Long, T = Tall, X = Extra, R = Regular, W = Wide. But then there are Ys and Ds.
I think I've found an answer re the voltage absence for the V12 & LG6 reference. They are Lucas Lucas batteries; the 6TXR13 is a Lucas CAV battery! This also disproves my theory (already!). Two grades of battery are tabled; the basic version of the 6TXR13 is 6TXW13. The listings are headed (basic) "WOOD SEPARATORS", whilst the 6TXR13 is under "DELUXE MODELS WITH THREADED RUBBER INSULATION". Thus, W = Wood, and R = Rubber. Cor, this reminds me of algebra!
The 6TXR13 specifcation is: Actual capacity in amp hours when discharged in 10 hours; 75amps, and in 20 hours, 85 amps. Length 8 1/2", Length over lugs 9 3/8" (in other words, that will presumably be the original spacing for your mounting studs), Width 6 7/8", and Height over terminals 9 1/2". Regarding that latter, note that the height with cover isn't stated, probably because the cover was an extra, 5/6d!
Unfortunately for me, not so easy for my V12 batteries, there is no reference close enough, but perhaps I can figure something out. I can see that the only other cars fitted with 2-SLTR15E were Alvis SP25s and 4.3s.
Laurence

Subject: Re: Battery advice for LG45

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Hi Laurence,
I think you're right about the Lagonda factory numbers - my wheels are the same number as yours, Z4101/2.